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Author: Subject: I was wrong about Palin

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 10:50 PM
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I don't think one person posting in this thread gave her a fair shake you based 90% of everything you learned about her from the media,and that in it's self says alot, to everyone who has given her a fair shake knows she is a genuine person who cares very much for this country. But you did not give her a chance instead you listened to BS from a one sided media.... and still you can not quit talking about her....


No... I saw and heard the words come from her mouth. I watched and listened to the Katie Couric interviews. I watched and listened to her form thoughts and speak her mind during her debate w/Sen. Biden. I watched as she stood by her daughter who was having a child out of wedlock while the good Governor preached ABSTINENCE to the youth of Alaska.

ACTIONS speak louder than words.

Simply "caring for this country" is not enough to be Vice president.

Apology accepted.

 

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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 10:53 PM
Palin cares about Palin.

Period.

it is ALL about her.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 10:58 PM


I will say this ONE MORE TIME! show me how Obama is more experienced than palin what


My opinion was formed, as were others in here, by her actions and her words. I'm not bashing her, I'm telling you why I couldn't support her, and after listening to some of her speeches, why I came to dislike her. As for a difference between Obama and Palin.....Obama read the Constitution and understands it.....that's a biggie for me.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:04 PM
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Show me a man who has never made a mistake, and I'll show you someone who has never done anything. I thought her convention speech was magnificent too, not in line with my politics, but very ably delivered.

It has pained me to see both McCain and Palin made out as some evil entities by some on my side of the race. Such earlier behavior from the Roves of the world equally disgusted me. As to Palin, while her politics are nearly the polar opposite from mine, she is entitled to her opinions.

For the GOP to blame her for the loss is to blame her for existing. The presumably seasoned advisors for McCain and the Senator himself chose her. They made the conscious choice to pick an everywoman, and they got what they bargained for. She did what was asked of her, except for a couple of late rogue moves that by then did not affect the outcome.

Sure she was unqualified, and McCain gave up the experience position in so choosing. But it was his error, not hers(all those beauty contests probably gave her an inflated view of herself, so no blame for her to accept the choice). She is probably alot like many of the mothers/wives in my town, politically right wing, yet still decent enough people, but also not in any way prepared to be President.

I don't see a national future for Palin, but as a Democrat, I hope the GOP ignores my advice! Bobby Jindal looks like a much better new face for the GOP. But his name is foreign(his first name ain't Bobby!), so maybe the faithful will reject him for that alone.


Meanwhile I saw Rove on Fox last night and he was incredibly gracious and pointed out what an exciting day it is for America to have elected a black man as president. So maybe he's not the devil he's made out to be either.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:07 PM
Meanwhile I saw Rove on Fox last night and he was incredibly gracious and pointed out what an exciting day it is for America to have elected a black man as president. So maybe he's not the devil he's made out to be either.

No way I'm letting my guard down around that man.....if he's being nice, he's planning something, you can just bet on it!

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:16 PM
quote:
Meanwhile I saw Rove on Fox last night and he was incredibly gracious and pointed out what an exciting day it is for America to have elected a black man as president. So maybe he's not the devil he's made out to be either.


What did he say, congrats to the man who fathered two black children in wedlock? I'm in a serene, forgiving mood, but not toward the architect of the wedge issue.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:20 PM
He would have said the same thing about a woman winning last night. And Hilary would have won as well.

 

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World Class Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:29 PM
Rydethewind, the reasons that people keep talking about Palin are pretty clear:
1. up until a mere 24 hours ago, she could have been in the White House. That makes her very important, and no joke!

2. did you watch McCain's concession speech? he did more or less pass the torch on to her, as if to suggest that we would see more of her. Many people do think / say that she is being groomed for 2012. It would make sense to discuss her, then.

I do disagree with some of your points. You call people out for saying that they only know Palin from the media; that is the only way I know ANY of the candidates. I believe it is the only way YOU know them also. The media does include Fox, Wall Street Journal, Hannity, Rush, Coulter; it is disingenuous to deny that there is PLENTY of right wing media.
As for disparaging Barack Obama for being college educated and never having fired a gun, reconsider his background. He grew up in a small apartment raised by his grandparents. No millionaire. I know that some of the media that we watch (Fox News!) have painted him as an elitist - but consider his life story. He is NOT a George Bush who was born with the silver spoon in his mouth.

THAT is one of the biggest lies that people bought, speaking of the media. I know plenty of people who believed that George W. really was a man of the people, "just like us," the guy we'd love to have a beer with - look, he chops brush!!! A Washington outsider!! But a tiny amount of homework showed that he was born into millions of dollars, he had businesses handed to him that he drove into the ground, he went to prep school and then Yale and lived in New England for much of his life, yet still threw around the ole Texas accent - I mean, it goes on and on. Ridiculous. A Washington "outsider" - whose father and grandfather were Washington politicians?! But people bought it. That is how he got elected.
So, while I realize that Sarah Palin is not Bush, she has proven very capable of presenting herself as Girl Next Door with Great Moral Values Who Knows Real America like Bush did, and I take it with a grain of salt. And we all saw her interviews with Katie Couric. They were real, and they were really painful. The revolution was televised.

I still do wonder what her future will be. Indeed, the Republicans have a remarkable choice. John McCain was the Republican that many Democrats loved in the 90s; I would have voted for him vs. Gore. He changed his stripes in a conspiciously artificial way to try to get elected, and he lost the respect of many. Still, had he chosen a Joe Lieberman or Mitt Romney as VP, he might have won. So, how will they respond? Will they go with a centrist in 2012 or will they give us a neo-con?

 

True Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:35 PM
quote:
He would have said the same thing about a woman winning last night. And Hilary would have won as well.


As someone who voted for Hillary in the primary, I have been wondering if she could have won. If she was the nominee, McCain wouldn't have picked Palin, and I doubt Hillary would have inspired the young or blacks as Obama did. I think I'm glad my party rejected my choice.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:36 PM
quote:

I will say this ONE MORE TIME! show me how Obama is more experienced than palin what?



It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt . -- George Eliot ...

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:38 PM
quote:
I think I'm glad my party rejected my choice.


I voted for Hillary and I want to say to the above....me too.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:45 PM
As far as Palin being part of the GOP ticket in 2012, I can't see it. History has shown that I suck at predictions, but as Brock mentioned, Bob Jindal looks like a man to watch.

He's smooth, articulate, young, and very bright. He seems to be a real conservative and I'll be rooting for him. A debate/race between he and Barack will be something to see.

Jindal - 2012!

 

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Peach Head



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  posted on 11/5/2008 at 11:46 PM
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The "Evil Media" which includes Bill O' Reilly, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, et al, ran a piece about Palin on the O' Reilly Factor tonight that portayed Palin as being completely uncoachable, refusing to be prepped before the Katie Couriic interview, and then blaming subordinates for her abysmal performance, while at the same time refusing to take responsibility for same; having her sycophants put clothing purchases on their own credit cards above the $150K allocated by the RNP (for which they were reportedly reimbursed) and practically having no direct communcation with McCain by the end of the campaign.

This by an arm of the RIGHT-wing media.....


If this is true, it just validates how ineffectively she was vetted by McCain and his campaign. If someone had those character traits, and was in the public eye for a number of years, it would be common knowledge about her being a "team" player.
But remember, she did say she was a maverick, so maybe that is exactly what she is????
She didn't influence my vote - was for Obama early in the primaries - but she did get me to do a bit of work locally for the Obama ticket, and give some $ to the Dem's...which I wouldn't have done otherwise. So in effect, she got me off my butt to work against her
zeke

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 12:10 AM

at least i can identify with a person like her and have some things in common with her i have NOTHING in common with a law student from Chicago who got into the senate and has never hunted, never gone out and cut wood to heat his house he is a city boy, regardless i will support him as i would have Mccain fully... but the bashing Palin has to stop the game is over..


This "identify with" thing is why people like W get elected. I don't want to identify with my President. I want him to be a whole hell of a lot smarter than I am and a lot more responsible. I don't expect him to be my friend or ever have a beer with him.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 01:02 AM
Moose are worried.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 07:06 AM
Being a democart, I probably would never vote for her anyway, but Palin now has the chance to create the image she wants to present in front of the country rather than have the McCain campaign do it. We'll see what happens. If she comes out pitting 'real' America against the rest of America, we'll have a true measure of her. I pray she doesn't do that.

On Hillary, I believe she would have bit at the negative bait that the McCain would have thrown at her. The Clintons advocate fighting back. I think Obama staying away from directly responding is one of the things that helped his campaign. I think Hillary would have gotten down in the mud and lost a lot of new voters that Obama brought out.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 07:17 AM
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NPR had reported that Rick Davis was behind the decision. McCain wanted somebody more well-known and established, but was talked out of it. They didn't think there was much of a chance to win the election anyway, and Davis convinced him to "throw deep" or spend the rest of his life wondering what if. It was a risky move that they became convinced had to be taken.


This sounds about right...I don't like her positions on most of the issues, but her personality energized the campaign at a time when McCain was really faltering. I'd say they didn't connect on the deep route, but maybe this was more like a surprise tackle eligible completion for a critical first down at midfield. Without her, the race ends at the convention.

In hindsight, a more traditional pick would have served him better when the financial crisis hit - since I think that was ultimately as much McCain's undoing as being associated with Bush (fairly or not) Palin, his flip flopping on issues and his positions in general - but from the results Tuesday, I don't think he ever had any real chance to win this thing.

Interesting to see if she has any national staying power or retreats to Alaska.

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 08:34 AM
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quote:
Palin garnered my disdain when she accepted the position on the ticket and then tried to convince the public she was qualified for the position. I'm not saying she wouldn't have been a good choice later in her career but I don't respect people who tend to over estimate their importance. She could have just said 'no'. As Dirty Harry said....'Man's gotta know his limitations.'


I will say this ONE MORE TIME! show me how Obama is more experienced than palin what? has he ever goverened answer NOTHING! Palin if she is not qualified then Obama is not qualified either . because she was not on your ticket because she did not say what YOU wanted to hear she is wrong... lol please ANN you are way smarter than this the media looked for every way possible to make her look bad simply because she was popular and on the wrong side it is my story and i am sticking to it!.. at least i can identify with a person like her and have some things in common with her i have NOTHING in common with a law student from Chicago who got into the senate and has never hunted, never gone out and cut wood to heat his house he is a city boy, regardless i will support him as i would have Mccain fully... but the bashing Palin has to stop the game is over..


I'm not sure what the job description of "President of the United States" contains so I'm not sure what this abstract idea of "experience" to be President actually is. Therefore, I'm not sure Obama has more "experience" than McCain. Likewise, I'm not sure what "experience" McCain has that would make him a more effective leader. What I perceived during this election is Obama is bright, insightful, articulate, interested in the art and science of governing, calm, rational, practical, pragmatic, and learned. I perceived none of these personality traits in Palin. Lastly, the sheer efficiency and brilliance with which Obama ran his election staff, organization, etc. tells me a great deal about his abilities as a leader.....Oh, and climbing the ladder in the very rough world of Chicago politics is also rather telling. I'm not sure politics in Alaska is quite as cut throat, but I could be wrong.

[Edited on 11/6/2008 by Chain]

 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 09:03 AM
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Rydethewind, the reasons that people keep talking about Palin are pretty clear:
1. up until a mere 24 hours ago, she could have been in the White House. That makes her very important, and no joke!

2. did you watch McCain's concession speech? he did more or less pass the torch on to her, as if to suggest that we would see more of her. Many people do think / say that she is being groomed for 2012. It would make sense to discuss her, then.

I do disagree with some of your points. You call people out for saying that they only know Palin from the media; that is the only way I know ANY of the candidates. I believe it is the only way YOU know them also. The media does include Fox, Wall Street Journal, Hannity, Rush, Coulter; it is disingenuous to deny that there is PLENTY of right wing media.
As for disparaging Barack Obama for being college educated and never having fired a gun, reconsider his background. He grew up in a small apartment raised by his grandparents. No millionaire. I know that some of the media that we watch (Fox News!) have painted him as an elitist - but consider his life story. He is NOT a George Bush who was born with the silver spoon in his mouth.

THAT is one of the biggest lies that people bought, speaking of the media. I know plenty of people who believed that George W. really was a man of the people, "just like us," the guy we'd love to have a beer with - look, he chops brush!!! A Washington outsider!! But a tiny amount of homework showed that he was born into millions of dollars, he had businesses handed to him that he drove into the ground, he went to prep school and then Yale and lived in New England for much of his life, yet still threw around the ole Texas accent - I mean, it goes on and on. Ridiculous. A Washington "outsider" - whose father and grandfather were Washington politicians?! But people bought it. That is how he got elected.
So, while I realize that Sarah Palin is not Bush, she has proven very capable of presenting herself as Girl Next Door with Great Moral Values Who Knows Real America like Bush did, and I take it with a grain of salt. And we all saw her interviews with Katie Couric. They were real, and they were really painful. The revolution was televised.

I still do wonder what her future will be. Indeed, the Republicans have a remarkable choice. John McCain was the Republican that many Democrats loved in the 90s; I would have voted for him vs. Gore. He changed his stripes in a conspiciously artificial way to try to get elected, and he lost the respect of many. Still, had he chosen a Joe Lieberman or Mitt Romney as VP, he might have won. So, how will they respond? Will they go with a centrist in 2012 or will they give us a neo-con?


Great post i think my point was made that by watching the media and it is all biases one way or another,nbc,fox,cnn,abc whatever ever side they happen to be on is the side America see's on that subject period. it is well know that all media is anti gun and Couric and company really are, all the bashing for the wolf hunting ,moose hunting etc etc made her out to be as some called in here a moose hunting bimbo, why because she hunted and was in shape and presented herself well? no because people are afraid of what they do not understand,and hunting for food is one thing 99% of city dwellers do not understand. That in itself is ok after all we live in many places but to watch a TV show on purpose make light of any persons way of life is just sad.

I would bet you can take any canidate and gear the questions to make them look bad,i admit Palin needed alot of homework but that says nothing about her, that only speaks of things she needs to learn and we all are in that boat!

As a example of the above i could grill Obama on the Salmon Runs of Russia,and what bears they have to hunt as well as the Goshawks on Kanchatka Island i garuntee you i can make him look Bad, and yes i realize those are hardly worldly matters but you get my drift.

I just think it is time to quit bashing anyone and lets judge these people on how they do their jobs,not how they talk,dress, what they look like, and any other petty reasons we as people are better than that.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 12:12 PM
If Palin were to run for president, I wouldn't mind being her VP. Who wouldn't want to work under her?

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 02:14 PM
quote:

As promised, I said I would post a thread if I was wrong. I guess it was foolish to jump on the bandwagon on the strength of one speech. As it turned out, she was clearly unqualified and turned out to be a drag on the ticket.

Won't be the last thing I do dumb. Take your shots.

Sorry. I was wrong.



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Universal Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 02:18 PM
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NPR had reported that Rick Davis was behind the decision. McCain wanted somebody more well-known and established, but was talked out of it. They didn't think there was much of a chance to win the election anyway, and Davis convinced him to "throw deep" or spend the rest of his life wondering what if. It was a risky move that they became convinced had to be taken.

______________________________________________________________________
After all the negativity of the Bush era I was actually surprised when Obama did not run away with it from the beginning. Palin gave a short time bump, but over time was exposed as a fraud. With McCain close in the popular vote, I wonder how he would have fared in the electoral vote with Romney or Lieberman at his side. Someone made a big mistake on Palin.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 02:24 PM
quote:
quote:
NPR had reported that Rick Davis was behind the decision. McCain wanted somebody more well-known and established, but was talked out of it. They didn't think there was much of a chance to win the election anyway, and Davis convinced him to "throw deep" or spend the rest of his life wondering what if. It was a risky move that they became convinced had to be taken.

______________________________________________________________________
After all the negativity of the Bush era I was actually surprised when Obama did not run away with it from the beginning. Palin gave a short time bump, but over time was exposed as a fraud. With McCain close in the popular vote, I wonder how he would have fared in the electoral vote with Romney or Lieberman at his side. Someone made a big mistake on Palin.


Romney, yes. Liberman, no.

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 02:24 PM
quote:
quote:
Palin garnered my disdain when she accepted the position on the ticket and then tried to convince the public she was qualified for the position. I'm not saying she wouldn't have been a good choice later in her career but I don't respect people who tend to over estimate their importance. She could have just said 'no'. As Dirty Harry said....'Man's gotta know his limitations.'


I will say this ONE MORE TIME! show me how Obama is more experienced than palin what? has he ever goverened answer NOTHING! Palin if she is not qualified then Obama is not qualified either . because she was not on your ticket because she did not say what YOU wanted to hear she is wrong... lol please ANN you are way smarter than this the media looked for every way possible to make her look bad simply because she was popular and on the wrong side it is my story and i am sticking to it!.. at least i can identify with a person like her and have some things in common with her i have NOTHING in common with a law student from Chicago who got into the senate and has never hunted, never gone out and cut wood to heat his house he is a city boy, regardless i will support him as i would have Mccain fully... but the bashing Palin has to stop the game is over..

_______________________________________________________________________
Talk about 'blind loyalty'. I guess you never really tried to learn anything about Obama if you can dare to compare the 2.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/6/2008 at 02:26 PM
quote:


I would bet you can take any canidate and gear the questions to make them look bad,i admit Palin needed alot of homework but that says nothing about her, that only speaks of things she needs to learn and we all are in that boat!

As a example of the above i could grill Obama on the Salmon Runs of Russia,and what bears they have to hunt as well as the Goshawks on Kanchatka Island i garuntee you i can make him look Bad, and yes i realize those are hardly worldly matters but you get my drift.




Sara Palin had a hard time with the question...

"What magazines do you read to stay current?"

Her answer.. "All of them"

asked again to be specific, she responded "I read everything"

When asked a 3rd time, to be MORE specific.. She again answered.. "You know, all of them"

How hard would it have been to say.... "The Wall Street Journal"..?

The problem for the Governor here would have been the difficult follow up question:

"Who is your favorite writer with the WSJ?..

Sara Palin..."You know, all of them"


To "gear" hard questions toward a Candidate, they have to answer the EASY ones first.

 

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