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Author: Subject: Map of States that Mooch the Most

Maximum Peach





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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 05:23 PM
Which States take the most Federal money compared to what they contribute?

Follow this link to find out:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/24/most-dependent-states-in-the-us_n_ 6930634.html

 

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Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 05:36 PM
Alabama is #47!!!!! Alloak, how can that be?
 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 06:49 PM
#50 is a blue state. Great job HuffPo.
 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 07:01 PM
quote:
#50 is a blue state. Great job HuffPo.


I think they meant Republican States are more dependent on government that Democrat States.

Which is exactly what they said and exactly what that map indicates. New Mexico is an outlier and does effect the total but doesn't change HuffPo's thesis.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 07:07 PM
At the absolute bottom of the list is a blue state. New Mexico #50. Any point that was (supposedly) being made is totally squashed. Thanks for the chuckle, though.
 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 07:27 PM
quote:
At the absolute bottom of the list is a blue state. New Mexico #50. Any point that was (supposedly) being made is totally squashed. Thanks for the chuckle, though.



Alabama is right there with them at 47. Look at the top of the list, NJ is #1, Delaware is #2, Illinois 3 and Minnesota 4. Look at the entire picture, not the cherry picked points that help you.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 07:31 PM
New Mexico - #50. A BLUE STATE? How can that be?

Thanks HuffPo.

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 08:44 PM
quote:
New Mexico - #50. A BLUE STATE? How can that be?

Thanks HuffPo.


Yeah whatever. This flew over your head or you are being obtuse. About what I would expect from #47. You must be proud.

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 08:50 PM
Mississippi #49
Kentucky #48
Alabama #47
Montana #46
West Virginia #45
Arizona #44
Louisiana #43
South Dakota #42
Maine #41

Alloak, care to comment?

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 09:24 PM
With a blue state in last place, ever stop and think there may be other factors at play besides voting patterns? Ya think?

This is the type of garbage that attempts to establish proof based on a faulty correlation and serves no purpose but to divide people. Thanks HuffPo.

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 09:57 PM
It never claimed to be an absolute. It said that overall red states got more from the federal government than blue states. You can bag on New Mexico all that you want to, but the overall 50 states average says it all. It appears that the money the Feds gave Alabama was not spent on reading comprehension classes.
 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 10:01 PM
quote:
It never claimed to be an absolute. It said that overall red states got more from the federal government than blue states.


I'm not debating that. I'm saying this can be attributed to numerous factors other than voting patterns. Unlike voting patterns, meaningful parameters.

Again, this type of crap doesn't establish anything meaningful. All it does is divide people. Good for HuffPo.








[Edited on 3/25/2015 by alloak41]

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 10:19 PM
quote:
New Mexico is an outlier and does effect the total but doesn't change HuffPo's thesis.



And that thesis is what? That certain states accept more revenue than they pay in. The reason for that is the citizens in those states are more likely to vote for one party over another?

Please.






[Edited on 3/25/2015 by alloak41]

 

True Peach



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 10:54 PM

Whoever said it was just a river.

[Edited on 3/25/2015 by gondicar]

 

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Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/24/2015 at 11:09 PM
quote:
quote:
New Mexico is an outlier and does effect the total but doesn't change HuffPo's thesis.



And that thesis is what? That certain states accept more revenue than they pay in. The reason for that is the citizens in those states are more likely to vote for one party over another?

Please.






[Edited on 3/25/2015 by alloak41]


No, genius, you have your cause and effect reversed. The states where the voters say that they want government out of their lives (red states) are the states that accept the most help from the federal government. Now do you understand?

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 06:59 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
New Mexico is an outlier and does effect the total but doesn't change HuffPo's thesis.



And that thesis is what? That certain states accept more revenue than they pay in. The reason for that is the citizens in those states are more likely to vote for one party over another?

Please.






[Edited on 3/25/2015 by alloak41]


No, genius, you have your cause and effect reversed. The states where the voters say that they want government out of their lives (red states) are the states that accept the most help from the federal government. Now do you understand?

He made you look silly.


Bingo!

It quantifies a position counter to all that stuff alloak likes to believe & post.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 08:18 AM
Based on that article? Are you kidding me? Total BS. Ranks right up there with the "intelligence" maps. The use of the words "mooch" and "dependent" are of course totally loaded and misleading. One of the biggest factors you failed to take into consideration is federal military spending. Bases, troops, production facilities, all of that does not constitute "Mooching" off of the federal government, or being dependent. Also, how much in farm subsidies are paid out each state? Do you consider that mooching? Let's create a map of corporate welfare and see what it looks like.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 08:46 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
New Mexico is an outlier and does effect the total but doesn't change HuffPo's thesis.



And that thesis is what? That certain states accept more revenue than they pay in. The reason for that is the citizens in those states are more likely to vote for one party over another?

Please.






[Edited on 3/25/2015 by alloak41]


No, genius, you have your cause and effect reversed. The states where the voters say that they want government out of their lives (red states) are the states that accept the most help from the federal government. Now do you understand?


So what's your point? Should a person change their political philosophies because they live in a state that accepts more than it pays in? Or should I move to a state where the numbers are reversed since I rarely vote for Democrats?

How much Alabama pays in or accepts in revenue is absolutely and totally beyond my control. You're trying to attach meaning to something that has no meaning.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 08:59 AM
quote:
Based on that article? Are you kidding me? Total BS. Ranks right up there with the "intelligence" maps. The use of the words "mooch" and "dependent" are of course totally loaded and misleading. One of the biggest factors you failed to take into consideration is federal military spending. Bases, troops, production facilities, all of that does not constitute "Mooching" off of the federal government, or being dependent. Also, how much in farm subsidies are paid out each state? Do you consider that mooching? Let's create a map of corporate welfare and see what it looks like.


Spot on. Here's an idea. Let's put all the military bases, illegal immigrants, and agricultural operations in Connecticut and Massachusetts and see what happens to HuffPo's "thesis."

In the meantime, I've noticed all the Arizonians and Texans moving in droves to retire in Rhode Island.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 09:13 AM
quote:
quote:
Based on that article? Are you kidding me? Total BS. Ranks right up there with the "intelligence" maps. The use of the words "mooch" and "dependent" are of course totally loaded and misleading. One of the biggest factors you failed to take into consideration is federal military spending. Bases, troops, production facilities, all of that does not constitute "Mooching" off of the federal government, or being dependent. Also, how much in farm subsidies are paid out each state? Do you consider that mooching? Let's create a map of corporate welfare and see what it looks like.


Spot on. Here's an idea. Let's put all the military bases, illegal immigrants, and agricultural operations in Connecticut and Massachusetts and see what happens to HuffPo's "thesis."

In the meantime, I've noticed all the Arizonians and Texans moving in droves to retire in Rhode Island.


This whole thing goes both ways.

One of the reasons that maps like this are made and articles like that are written are as a response to the right-wing theme of "People vote Democrat for the free stuff. All those lazy idiots vote Democrat while we are the producers and we pay for it all. Every election, Democrats take an early lead until Republicans get off work! HAW HAW!"

If this "HuffPo thesis" is silly, BS, whatever, then isn't the same reasoning used in reverse also BS?

Wonder how much of the 47% that won't take responsibility for their own lives voted for Romney anyway? Hmmmmmm.

quote:
The use of the words "mooch" and "dependent" are of course totally loaded and misleading.


When used against the left, it seems to be OK...

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 09:15 AM
Here's the methodology for the statistical analysis:

Return on Taxes Paid to the Federal Government (Federal Funding in $ Divided by Federal Income Taxes in $): Weight = 1
Federal Funding as a Percentage of State Revenue (Federal Funding in $ Divided by State Revenue in $ then Multiplied by 100): Weight = 1
Number of Federal Employees per Capita (Number of Federal Workers Divided by Number of State Residents): Weight = 0.5
Number of Civilian Non-Defense Federal Employees per Capita (Total Federal Civilian Employment Minus Total Civilian Employment of Army, Air Force, Navy & Defense Department): Weight = 0.25

Conclusions will, of course, vary.

"Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. Forty percent of all people know that." - Homer Simpson

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 09:29 AM
quote:
At the absolute bottom of the list is a blue state. New Mexico #50. Any point that was (supposedly) being made is totally squashed. Thanks for the chuckle, though.

Like every complex story, outliers and exceptions to the rule exist. But itís hard to ignore patterns that emerge. And when you overlay with data about quality of education and education policy, it isn't hard to start to understand why things are what they are. It's been shown time and again that a well-educated population is a major key to economic success, and by and large, the states that need/take the most federal support dollars are also the ones that are doing the poorest job educating their kids (regardless of whether they are red/blue politically). It is pretty consistent no matter what source you go by. Here's just a few...

http://www.alec.org/publications/report-card-on-american-education/

http://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-the-best-schools/5335/

http://www.nea.org/home/44479.htm




[Edited on 3/25/2015 by gondicar]

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 11:35 AM
quote:

If this "HuffPo thesis" is silly, BS, whatever, then isn't the same reasoning used in reverse also BS?


Absolutely. Its total BS both ways. We're all way better than that.

[Edited on 3/25/2015 by DougMacKenzie]

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 12:42 PM
I think the thesis has a little more to do with an attempt at opening the eyes of the voters of the Red States. It seems those folks screaming for smaller government will suffer the most as government shrinks.

Perhaps voters in those States should listen less to rich right wing conservatives and sum up their own situation based on facts.

Every single American is dependent, in one way or another, on our Federal Government. I think HuffPo is pointing out the irony of the people who are most dependent on the Government vote against their interests.

Some people will call that low information voting.

Maybe the folks in the Red States are just super patriotic and are willing to accept more hardship for the good of the rest of the Nation.

I salute them.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 3/25/2015 at 05:14 PM
quote:
I think the thesis has a little more to do with an attempt at opening the eyes of the voters of the Red States. It seems those folks screaming for smaller government will suffer the most as government shrinks.

Perhaps voters in those States should listen less to rich right wing conservatives and sum up their own situation based on facts.

Every single American is dependent, in one way or another, on our Federal Government. I think HuffPo is pointing out the irony of the people who are most dependent on the Government vote against their interests.

Some people will call that low information voting.

Maybe the folks in the Red States are just super patriotic and are willing to accept more hardship for the good of the rest of the Nation.

I salute them.

So I guess what you are saying is that folks with conservative values should "open their eyes" and listen to the poor left wing conservatives? Smaller government, at least to me, does not mean no government. It means cutting all the duplication of services, the fraud, the waste, and getting rid of some of the intrusiveness of especially the last 15 years. How could that be a bad thing? I work for the government in education right now and you would not believe the idiotic waste of time, money and resources that goes on. I've worked for the government in past years in vocational rehab and it was even worse there. It all starts at the top, not with the rank and file. There is almost zero accountability for administration at the federal, state, or local level. If I lost my job because the government became more efficient I would do what I had to do to survive. I can live with that. It would beat the hell out of living off of the hard earned income of others of no other reason than to be taken care of. I believe if people got to keep more of their money the economy would get better, not worse, and would eventually be better for everyone. If you are implying that the only way these conservative people can be successful is through government provision and to think otherwise is low information ignorance then we will just have to disagree. As someone with conservative values I would rather work for minimum wage, live within my means, and feel good about what I am doing than be a dependent mooch.

 

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