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Author: Subject: four dead in ohio

Peach Master





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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 07:04 AM
today is the 45th anniversary of the kent state massacre.
 
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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 08:06 AM
From Wiki :

A Gallup Poll taken immediately after the shootings showed that 58 percent of respondents blamed the students, 11 percent blamed the National Guard and 31 percent expressed no opinion.

 

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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 08:41 AM
Rich Kelly, a freelance writer for the Star Beacon and Jefferson resident, said he was living in Chardon at the time but had a trip to Kent on that fateful morning.

He wasn’t just on campus, but the shooting affected him personally because he knew Krause. Kelly said they had been on several dates.

“Our paths crossed and we got along real good. We just went out a couple of times,” he said.
He said they discussed the Vietnam War some but she was somewhat opposed to the war.

“She was not a rabble rouser,” he said.

Kelly said he was splitting his time between the Geauga County branch of the university and the main campus. He said there were a lot of people protesting that were not Kent State students and a lot of drunk people had vandalized downtown Kent days before the shootings.

Kelly said he went to pick up some books early on the morning of May 4 and headed back home to Chardon where he later heard of the shootings.

The days leading into the shooting and following the historic event provided much room for speculation. “There were rumors galore,” he said. “If it hadn’t been for outside agitators, that never would have happened.”

http://www.starbeacon.com/news/area-residents-remember-kent-state-years-ago /article_72c234a6-f10e-11e4-955a-db047bb04c82.html

 

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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 10:50 AM
quote:
From Wiki :

A Gallup Poll taken immediately after the shootings showed that 58 percent of respondents blamed the students, 11 percent blamed the National Guard and 31 percent expressed no opinion.


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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 04:16 PM
quote:
The days leading into the shooting and following the historic event provided much room for speculation. “There were rumors galore,” he said. “If it hadn’t been for outside agitators, that never would have happened.”


Would love to have this "outside agitator" thing explained to me?

 

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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 04:39 PM
So much revision going on about sixties/ seventies history.

500,000 in DC for the Moratorium. That commie Earl Scruggs played.

http://youtu.be/nGDp--0SbX8


500 colleges demonstrate on End the War day.

By '73 65% of Americans opposed the war.

Outside agitators are people like Gandhi and MLK.

"I'm tired of old men dreaming up wars for young men to die in". George McGovern.

[Edited on 5/4/2015 by aiq]

 

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  posted on 5/4/2015 at 04:55 PM
years ago I detoured there, I had to see it for myself. A guy I met later on was there that day, he said he decided to go back to the dorm to get his camera right before everything happened. good move.
 
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  posted on 5/5/2015 at 07:46 AM
quote:
quote:
The days leading into the shooting and following the historic event provided much room for speculation. “There were rumors galore,” he said. “If it hadn’t been for outside agitators, that never would have happened.”


Would love to have this "outside agitator" thing explained to me?


I wasn't there but do have somewhat of an interest in the subject as I am a native Ohioan.

A wealth of info here if you are interested:

http://www.may4archive.org/era.shtml

http://www.may4archive.org/chronology.shtml

 

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  posted on 5/5/2015 at 07:50 AM
and then there is this:

WHAT ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT UNANSWERED QUESTIONS ABOUT THE MAY 4 SHOOTINGS?

Although we have attempted in this article to answer many of the most important and frequently asked questions about the May 4th shootings, our responses have sometimes been tentative because many important questions remain unanswered. It thus seems important to ask what are the most significant questions which yet remain unanswered about the May 4th events. These questions could serve as the basis for research projects by students who are interested in studying the shootings in greater detail.

(1) Who was responsible for the violence in downtown Kent and on the Kent State campus in the three days prior to May 4th? As an important part of this question, were "outside agitators" primarily responsible? Who was responsible for setting fire to the ROTC building?

(2) Should the Guard have been called to Kent and Kent State University? Could local law enforcement personnel have handled any situations? Were the Guard properly trained for this type of assignment?

(3) Did the Kent State University administration respond appropriately in their reactions to the demonstrations and with Ohio political officials and Guard officials?

(4) Would the shootings have been avoided if the rally had not been banned? Did the banning of the rally violate First Amendment rights?

(5) Did the Guardsmen conspire to shoot students when they huddled on the practice football field? If not, why did they fire? Were they justified in firing?

(6) Who was ultimately responsible for the events of May 4, 1970?

http://dept.kent.edu/sociology/lewis/lewihen.htm

 

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  posted on 5/6/2015 at 12:23 PM
At that time there was an us (Nixon) against them, (antiwar, leftists), mentality.
As a 13 year old. i remember arguing with my father at the dinner table.
A local Catholic Priest went to an anti-war rally in DC. He then made the mistake of sermonizing about it to my father and the other WWII vets at Sunday mass. They shipped out the Priest the next week
The shootings crystallized the hardcore positions on both sides.
People were ready to pick up guns, and luckily it went the other way.

 

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  posted on 5/6/2015 at 02:43 PM
Agree that emotions ran high on both sides of the war issue back then.

Regardless, even if there were "outside agitators" there's no excuse for the National Guard to have shot on the crowd like that

[Edited on 5/6/2015 by stormyrider]

 

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  posted on 4/27/2017 at 09:21 AM
Bumping this up for another upcoming anniversary.

 

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  posted on 4/27/2017 at 09:01 PM
Tomorrow is the 25th anniversary of the Rodney King Riots in Southern California.

Our country is very complicated for all sorts of reasons. When you get down to it, we just need to do the right thing whether one agrees or not. Be safe and vigilant everyone.

 

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  posted on 4/27/2017 at 10:25 PM
quote:
Tomorrow is the 25th anniversary of the Rodney King Riots in Southern California.

Our country is very complicated for all sorts of reasons. When you get down to it, we just need to do the right thing whether one agrees or not. Be safe and vigilant everyone.

 

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  posted on 5/1/2017 at 07:30 PM

We have changed from a nation where people were outraged that a National Guard troop would raise a gun at a protester, much less fire on one, to a nation where we are warned that at any time we may be under biological, nuclear or terror attacks. In addition to that, our liberties have not only been curtailed but taken away and given to the government. It is a usual and customary thing to be groped and manhandled at the airport, the cops or feds can come in your house without a warrant, go through your things, install spyware on your computer without your knowledge or consent, anyone who sees this is put under a gag order not to say anything or they can be imprisoned, you can be rounded up, carted off and sent to a prison anywhere, without being told why, you are not allowed to make a phone call, get a lawyer, you can be held and tortured for years and even killed and disposed of. They can put a hellfire drone in your car to execute you - all this because of the Patriot Act and the aftermath.

Yes things have changed, and not for the better. America can become great again, but what has become under previous leadership is downright shameful.


Drills next week in Ohio.

Role-Player Registration: OHIO
“Human Domain” Solutions, LLC
OHIO NATIONAL GUARD – HOMELAND RESPONSE FORCE
TRAINING EXERCISE (they recruit regular people to play actors they will pay you for your time and trouble.

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BOTH OPERATIONS – Dayton, OH – May 5 & 6, 2017 – PAYS – $275

This is not just another drill, like Operation Gotham, This drill has special relevance and could serve as a warning of a dire threat comgin to the American people.

WHAT WERE FEMA AGENTS RUNNING FROM?

1.World War III
2.A deadly purge within the military and the intelligence agencies
3.Chemical and/or biological attack

Is There A Jade Helm Connection?

Special Warfare. Special warfare is an umbrella term indicating operating force conduct of combinations of unconventional warfare (UW), foreign internal defense (FID), military information support operations (MISO), CT, and counterinsurgency (COIN) through and with indigenous personnel. With discreet, precise, politically astute, and scalable capabilities, ARSOF frequently undertake politically sensitive missions over extended periods of time in hostile, austere, and denied environments. Here, ARSOF’s deep language and cultural expertise enhance unit survivability through the recognition and understanding of emerging threats. Such capabilities also grant Army special operators influence over the human domain in pursuit of U.S. objectives, to avoid conflict, or to bring about a quick and enduring victory…

Take a look at the Jade Helm symbol and phrase: “Mastering the human domain”.

Now ,take a look at the company that is acquiring crisis actors for Operation Megadeath.

HD stands for Human Domain. What is with the establishment’s obsession with this term “mastering the human domain”. Many believe it is an euphemism for enslavement. I have serious reservations about any connection between Jade Helm and Operation Megadeath.

Draw your own conclusions, but the goal is to be able to control, contain the population in a war or attack or large scale civil unrest events.

Yes times have changed since Neil Young sung 'four dead in Ohio...'





[Edited on 5/2/2017 by gina]

 

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  posted on 5/2/2017 at 11:58 PM

 

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  posted on 5/3/2017 at 10:22 AM
Could you imagine what would happen to the millennials if the National Guard went after them? They get let out of school if they disagree with the results of an election.

I never would condone violence; but if my sorry ass got dragged to jail I know one father who would have taken days to bail me out

 

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  posted on 5/4/2017 at 08:46 AM
The Kent State shootings were the shootings of unarmed college students protesting the Vietnam War at Kent State University in Kent, Ohio, by burning the campus ROTC building and throwing rocks at the Guardsmen.

The massacre was perpetrated by members of the Ohio National Guard on May 4, 1970.

Twenty-nine guardsmen fired approximately 67 rounds over a period of 13 seconds, killing four students and wounding nine others, one of whom suffered permanent paralysis.

 

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  posted on 5/4/2017 at 08:53 AM
In 1970 I was 14, politically active, and convinced I would be in Nam in less than 4 years. Richard Nixon was the enemy and I truly despised the man. Kent State just showed the reality of government, as Waco did again. We think it has changed?

 

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  posted on 5/4/2017 at 09:47 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/03/us/soundtracks-kent-state-jackson-state-orang eburg/index.html

The Kent States you don't know about
By Breeanna Hare, CNN
Updated 8:56 PM ET, Wed May 3, 2017

(CNN)On May 4, 1970, 13 seconds of gunfire seemed to bring America to a halt.

On the Midwestern campus of Kent State University, four students had been killed and nine others were injured when Ohio National Guard members opened fire on demonstrators protesting the Guard's presence and the expansion of the Vietnam War.

The event so shocked the nation that more than 500 colleges were shut down as students responded to the killings with outraged protest. Life magazine and Newsweek dedicated cover stories to the incident, with Newsweek and The New York Times famously showcasing the now-iconic photograph of a young woman screaming as she knelt over the body of a Kent State student.

"Is dissent a crime?" the father of one of the slain students, 19-year-old Allison Krause, asked in Newsweek. "Is this such a reason for killing her? Have we come to such a state in this country that a young girl has to be shot because she disagrees deeply with the actions of her government?"

It's a question that likely weighed heavily on the minds of another group of parents farther South -- ones who'd also lost their children on college campuses in an eerily similar way.

Just 11 days after the deadly shooting in Ohio, two students were killed and 12 were wounded when police fired more than 100 rounds of bullets on protesters gathered at Mississippi's predominantly black Jackson State College.

And two years earlier, in 1968, three students were killed by authorities during protests against segregation at South Carolina State in Orangeburg, another historically black institution.

But there weren't national news magazine covers, Pulitzer Prize-winning photographs or popular songs memorializing these deaths, as Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young's "Ohio" did for Kent State.

For those who lived through the time, the reason for the lack of coverage on the other campus shootings is pretty simple: "Kent State was four white students in Ohio," said Gene Young, a former Jackson State professor, when asked by NPR why the tragedies at Jackson State and South Carolina State aren't as prominent in the nation's memory.

"Jackson State and Orangeburg were black colleges in the South," Young continued. "Two black students on a black college campus in Mississippi that had the history of Emmett Till, Medgar Evers, Chaney, Goodman and Schwerner. It was just another day of business as usual, racist law enforcement officials victimizing black people in Mississippi."

In recent years, documentarians, historians and others have worked to rectify the larger public's obliviousness to what happened at Jackson State and South Carolina State, ensuring that the students who lost their lives in protest, like those at Kent State, wouldn't be forgotten.

'Orangeburg Massacre' at South Carolina State

It started with a bowling alley.

In February 1968, students from historically black South Carolina State were protesting segregation at All Star Bowling lanes, the only bowling alley in Orangeburg.

On February 6, the first night of protest, students entered the bowling alley and were denied service, as one student participant recalled to USA Today. They went back a second night, and the tension began to reach a boiling point.

By the third night, on February 8, the student protest against segregation had moved back to campus, where it was later met with violence, as Jack Bass and Jack Nelson chronicle in their book on the incident, "The Orangeburg Massacre."

According to Bass's account, firemen arrived on campus to put out a bonfire erected by students, and state troopers were present to protect the firefighters.

After a tossed banister rail struck one state trooper in the face, 66 armed members of law enforcement lined up around the edge of campus and opened fire.

"Students fled in panic or dived for cover," Bass writes, "many getting shot in their backs and sides and even the soles of their feet."

Eight of the nearly 70 state troopers present that night later told the FBI that they fired their weapons after hearing shots.

By the end, after roughly 10 seconds of gunfire, nearly 30 students were injured and three were dead: Henry Smith, a South Carolina State sophomore; Samuel Hammond, a freshman; and Delano Middleton, a high school student whose mother worked at the school.

"South Carolina State was the first time ever in the history of America that a college student had been killed on their campus for doing absolutely nothing," remarked Cleveland Sellers, a civil rights activist who attended South Carolina State and was involved in the February protests, at a conference on the incident in 2012.

But "unlike Kent State," notes journalist Bass, "the students killed at Orangeburg were black, and the shooting occurred at night, leaving no compelling TV images.

"What happened barely penetrated the nation's consciousness."

30 seconds of gunfire at Jackson State

For its part, Kent State University has made an effort to remember the student lives lost at Jackson State in the wake of its own tragedy.

Nevertheless, another campus shooting in May 1970 has still gone largely unnoticed.

Even before the shootings, Jackson State students had been targeted with harassment and other acts of violence by whites who lived in the area. According to former JSU professor Young, "motorists would drive through the campus making racist (epithets), making (sexual) innuendos against some of the black female students on that campus."

On the night of May 14, The New York Times reported, bottles and rocks were thrown at white drivers passing through -- actions Jackson State students attributed to non-students on campus. A rumor that Charles Evers, mayor of a nearby town and the brother of slain civil rights leader Medgar Evers, had been killed only added to the unrest.
By midnight, armed local and state police had arrived at Jackson State.

"Things just came to a head when law enforcement officials marched onto the campus in front of Alexander Hall women's dormitory," Young recalled. "Shortly after midnight, a bottle broke on the pavement and law enforcement officials fired over 200 rounds of bullets into a women's dormitory from the bottom floor to the top floor."

The shots lasted 30 seconds, and a 1970 report from the President's Commission on Campus Unrest found that about 400 bullets or pieces of buckshot had been fired into the women's dorm, where witnesses said roughly 100 students were gathered.

According to The New York Times, police said they were responding to sniper fire; the federal investigation didn't find evidence of anyone shooting from the locations police targeted with their weapons.

There were reports of students shouting angrily at the officers and throwing rocks, as Evers acknowledged in a telegram to President Nixon. "I am not saying they were right for throwing rocks," Evers said in his telegram, according to the Times. "But rocks didn't warrant coming in and shooting. They (the police) came out to kill."
Two students died that night: 17-year-old James Earl Green, who was in high school, and 21-year-old Phillip L. Gibbs, a junior at Jackson State and the father of an 18-month-old.

Today, Jackson State, now a university, has the Gibbs-Green Monument, which the school describes as "a permanent memorial to the slain students and a tangible reminder to all students that the Jackson State Tragedy must never be forgotten."

 

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